Scuba Forum / Scuba Locations / July 2004
Passport to Cozumel??
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Nancy L. McMullen - 22 Apr 2004 05:16 GMT Hi All,
I was recently told by a fellow scuba diver that now everyone (children included) now need passports to enter Cozumel from the U.S. We've been going there since 1995 and have taken my stepdaughters with us, who are now 14 and 18. We will be going again at the end of July for a week. We've never had a problem getting in or out of Cozumel with my stepdaughters' birth certificates; my husband and I have valid passports, however.
I went to the U.S. Department of State Bureau of Consular Affairs on Mexico website, and this is how it read:
ENTRY REQUIREMENTS: The Government of Mexico requires that all U.S. citizens present proof of citizenship and photo identification for entry into Mexico. While U.S. citizenship documents such as a certified copy of a U.S. birth certificate, a Naturalization Certificate, a Consular Report of Birth Abroad, or a Certificate of Citizenship are acceptable, the U.S. Embassy recommends traveling with a valid U.S. passport to avoid delays or misunderstandings. U.S. citizens have encountered difficulty boarding onward flights in Mexico without a passport. U.S. citizens boarding flights to Mexico should be prepared to present one of these documents as proof of U.S. citizenship, along with photo identification. Driver's permits, voter registration cards, affidavits and similar documents are not sufficient to prove citizenship for readmission into the United States.
I don't see anything in there that says passports are required...recommended, yes, but not required by law - and nothing about children being required to have them now.
Anyone have thoughts or updates on this and can reference their information?
I certainly hope things are still as it reads under the "Entry Requirements" or it will truly be a major pain trying to get passports for my stepdaughters as they live the majority of the year out of state, and you must apply in person for a passport.
Thanks a lot in advance for any and all help here!
Nancy
Scubagrl's Themes n' Dreams http://www.scubagrl.net
Geoff - 22 Apr 2004 06:28 GMT This seems to indicate Mexico is enforcing ID requirements to ensure that anyone returning to the US will have sufficient ID to re-enter and not be sent back to Mexico by US immigration.
Talk to your travel agent for current requirements. Sometimes the web information is not current. Call your local office of US Bureau of Immigration and ask them if the travel agency seems at all unsure.
It was my understanding that minor children traveling with their passported parents are not required to have individual passports. A good form of ID like a certified birth certificate and picture ID of the child would be at least minimum documentation to bring with you.
Perhaps someone with children who has traveled recently to Cozumel will have more advice.
rwjg40 - 22 Apr 2004 18:08 GMT > This seems to indicate Mexico is enforcing ID requirements to ensure > that anyone returning to the US will have sufficient ID to re-enter > and not be sent back to Mexico by US immigration. It's not the Mexican government, it's the airline. They want to make sure that if they take you out of the country, they can get you back in. I am flying to Cozumel in May, and I just a minute ago spoke with a Continental agent, who told me that the requirements for proof of citizenship are the same as they were for my trip last year. I traveled there last May with my wife and daughter; none of us have passports, but we have photo ID and certified birth certs. We had no prob.
Don' worry, be happy...
Gordon in Austin
Greg Mossman - 23 Apr 2004 01:30 GMT > It's not the Mexican government, it's the airline. They want to make > sure that if they take you out of the country, they can get you back [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > there last May with my wife and daughter; none of us have passports, but > we have photo ID and certified birth certs. We had no prob. I screwed up a flight to Canada by forgetting my birth certificate or passport. I tried to talk the airline into letting me take my chances as I was sure I could talk the friendly Canadians into letting me into their country without proper ID, but no go. They didn't want to be responsible for me in case I was rejected at immigration.
H. Huntzinger - 22 Apr 2004 12:49 GMT > Hi All, > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Anyone have thoughts or updates on this and can reference their information? Yes: no matter what the hassles *might* be in the USA to get them passports, go get them their passports today.
Afterall, it is inevitable that the rules are going to change.
Afterall, since the one is clearly too young to drive, it is also a very easy and very cheap way of getting them a "Government Issue Photo ID".
> I certainly hope things are still as it reads under the "Entry Requirements" > or it will truly be a major pain trying to get passports for my stepdaughters > as they live the majority of the year out of state, and you must apply in > person for a passport. Incorrect.
First, only Minors are required to appear in person, and only if they're under age 14, so that requirement doesn't appear to even apply to you anyway.
Second, whatever you believe the hassle might be, compare it to what you think the hassle would be of a trashed vacation on the Mexico end, or on the returning-to-USA internment end. A passport to prevent these inconveniences is the world's cheapest insurance...less than $10/year!
Third, I personally find it _very_ hard to believe that appearing in person can even be claimed to be a "major pain". There are so many places you can go to apply that I find it hard to believe that one cannot be nearby. I've done it twice and both times found it painless. IMO, the only time that you're generally going to find crowds and hassles is when you wait until the last minute and have to go to one of the 48-hour turnaround service centers.
Fourth, their living out of state for most of the year shouldn't be an issue at all.
> Thanks a lot in advance for any and all help here! Since your trip is in July, you have more than 8 weeks of leadtime, so by acting now, you can do this on the "Routine" priority schedule, so it will cost less than $100 per applicant, including the photo costs.
Many camera stores and AAA club stores offer passport photos for $10 or so, while you wait.
Get a copy of the form before you go and fill it out at home. Not only does this save time, but it prevents embarassment when you don't know minutia such as your parents' _locations_ of birth, etc.
All the info you need can be found from this webpage:
http://travel.state.gov/passport_services.html
Just Do It.
-hh
HW \ - 22 Apr 2004 13:30 GMT >Yes: no matter what the hassles *might* be in the USA to get them >passports, go get them their passports today. I've done a lot of traveling and cannot imagine leaving the USA without a passport.
Anyone who considers it a "hassle" to get a passport - really doesn't know what a hassle is until they get into trouble in a foreign country without a passport.
By the way... Hugh Huntzinger... any updates on Tiara (Cayman Brac)? We're thinking of a few nights there later in the year. Mostly interested in hotel condition, food and bar.
-HW "Skip" Weldon Columbia, SC
Charlie Hammond - 22 Apr 2004 16:45 GMT >Anyone who considers it a "hassle" to get a passport - really doesn't >know what a hassle is until they get into trouble in a foreign country >without a passport. Agreed. From time to time the SCUBA and REC.TRAVEL newsgroups post horror stories of what can happen and how quickly and easily a vacation can be ruined. GET A PASSPORT.
Second point -- Neither the USA government, nor the airlines, nor any travel agent establishes the "official" requirement for entry by a USA citizen/resident into another sovereign country. The best and most up to date information can be obtained by calling the country's embasy or consolate.
Third point -- Also consider the requirement for re-entry into the USA.
If you travel internationally, your passport is your friend. Don't leave home without it! And if you don't have one, don't expect sympathy from me when things go wrong.
 Signature Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Drew M. Mooney - 13 Jul 2004 13:49 GMT > If you travel internationally, your passport is your friend. > Don't leave home without it! And if you don't have one, don't > expect sympathy from me when things go wrong. Sounds like the old 'and if you break your leg falling off that <whatever> don't come running to me' thing our parents used to screach at us....
Charlie Hammond - 13 Jul 2004 15:06 GMT >> If you travel internationally, your passport is your friend. >> Don't leave home without it! And if you don't have one, don't >> expect sympathy from me when things go wrong. >> >Sounds like the old 'and if you break your leg falling off that <whatever> >don't come running to me' thing our parents used to screach at us.... Perhaps, but customs and immigration officers tend to be less sypathetic than most parents.
 Signature Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
rwjg40 - 13 Jul 2004 15:30 GMT > >> If you travel internationally, your passport is your friend. > >> Don't leave home without it! And if you don't have one, don't [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Perhaps, but customs and immigration officers tend to be less sypathetic > than most parents. This is an old thread, isn't it? You don't need a passport to go to Cozumel from the U.S., just an official birth cert and photo ID.
Gordon in Austin
Charlie Hammond - 13 Jul 2004 17:33 GMT > ... You don't need a passport to go to >Cozumel from the U.S., just an official birth cert and photo ID. The http://travel.state.gov/foreignentryreaus.html site says "Proof of citizenship and photo ID". (a/o today, Tuesday, 2004-JUL-13) PLEASE read the entire site for various details.
A passport will provide this.
An "official birth certificate" usualy will suffice for proof of citizenship; a drivers license usualy will suffice for photo ID.
Note the use of the word "usually". A passport is highly desirable when things turn "unusual".
I consider it foolish to travel internationally without a passport. Other's opinions differ.
 Signature Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Dillon Pyron - 13 Jul 2004 18:50 GMT >> ... You don't need a passport to go to >>Cozumel from the U.S., just an official birth cert and photo ID. > >The http://travel.state.gov/foreignentryreaus.html site says >"Proof of citizenship and photo ID". (a/o today, Tuesday, 2004-JUL-13) >PLEASE read the entire site for various details. The Bearue of Citizenship and Immigration Services (our old friend INS) is about to issue an NPRM that will require a passport for exit from the US. I don't know if it will apply to airlines, but it will definitely apply to cruise ships.
>A passport will provide this. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >Note the use of the word "usually". >A passport is highly desirable when things turn "unusual". Although stamped and notarized, my wife's "official birth certificate" lacks the raised seal. It was good enough to get her a passport (after about 12 weeks), but it's not good enough for entry.
>I consider it foolish to travel internationally without a passport. >Other's opinions differ. I personally think anyone who travels should have a passport. First, it makes getting past TSA easier and it allows you to get that wild hair and take that $99 rt to Paris (which I've actually seen).
 Signature dillon
When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob.
Dillon Pyron - 13 Jul 2004 19:01 GMT >> ... You don't need a passport to go to >>Cozumel from the U.S., just an official birth cert and photo ID. > >The http://travel.state.gov/foreignentryreaus.html site says >"Proof of citizenship and photo ID". (a/o today, Tuesday, 2004-JUL-13) >PLEASE read the entire site for various details. Try this instead: http://travel.state.gov/foreignentryreqs.html
From the site: (emphasis mine)
PASSPORTS: U.S. citizens who travel to a country where a valid U.S. passport is not required will need documentary evidence of their U.S. citizenship and identity. Proof of U.S. citizenship includes an expired U.S. passport, a certified (original) birth certificate, Certificate of Naturalization, Certificate of Citizenship, or Report of Birth Abroad of a Citizen of the United States. To prove identity, a valid drivers license or government identification card are acceptable provided they identify you by physical description or photograph. However, for travel overseas and to facilitate reentry into the U.S., a valid U.S. passport is the best documentation ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ available and unquestionably proves your U.S. citizenship.
>A passport will provide this. > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >I consider it foolish to travel internationally without a passport. >Other's opinions differ.
 Signature dillon
When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob.
rwjg40 - 13 Jul 2004 22:28 GMT > I consider it foolish to travel internationally without a passport. > Other's opinions differ. Be that as it may, it is not necessary, or even better, as far as I can see, to have a passport for going to Cozumel. I've done it many times with birth cert and ID and never have I had the slightest trouble. I'd hazard a guess that more folks do it that way than by passport, judging from what I've seen in line in the Cozumel airport.
Gordon in Austin
Drew M. Mooney - 14 Jul 2004 15:27 GMT Hey Charlie, I wasn't attacking you man! Just making a funny...
-drew-
> >> If you travel internationally, your passport is your friend. > >> Don't leave home without it! And if you don't have one, don't [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Perhaps, but customs and immigration officers tend to be less sypathetic > than most parents. Charlie Hammond - 14 Jul 2004 17:56 GMT >Hey Charlie, I wasn't attacking you man! Just making a funny... Drew -- My responce was also intended to be taken lightly.
>> In article <WSQIc.404$nH.15@fe07.usenetserver.com>, "Drew M. Mooney" ><drew.mooney@pwhome.com> writes: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >> Perhaps, but customs and immigration officers tend to be less sypathetic >> than most parents.
 Signature Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Greg Mossman - 22 Apr 2004 17:48 GMT > I've done a lot of traveling and cannot imagine leaving the USA > without a passport. I've done a lot of traveling outside the USA without my passport, so I can certainly imagine it.
> Anyone who considers it a "hassle" to get a passport - really doesn't > know what a hassle is until they get into trouble in a foreign country > without a passport. Then don't get into trouble, that's what I suggest. Passports are easy to obtain and easy to carry so there's really no reason not to have one. But your concerns are exaggerated, at least with respect to Americans in Mexico. The only danger nowadays is trouble getting back into the U.S., especially if one appears hispanic or middle-eastern.
I went to Grand Cayman last year without a passport, only because I realized I couldn't find it one day before the trip. No one seemed put off by my use of a birth certificate and drivers license. I rushed to get a new passport before I left for Bonaire but felt foolish paying the expedited fee when I later found out I could have gone without one. I've lived my whole life within a few hours drive of either the Mexican or Canadian borders and never felt the need to bring a passport for a weekend trip. Heck, when I was really young and foolish, I went to Mexico without any identification at all, mainly so I could honestly claim to the customs inspector that I didn't have my ID when he questioned whether I was old enough to bring the booze back into the U.S. It worked.
I've done a lot of driving around Mexico and I've been pulled over plenty of times by the friendly local policia. I've been stopped at countless "narcotrafico" checkpoints and been harrassed by lots of local and federal cops and once by a couple marines on beach patrol looking for a few bucks. No one ever asked for my passport. The only time I ever worried about lack of documentation was the time I took the train down to Mexico City and the train left before the immigration office opened leaving me with no tourist card. That became a worry when I got sick and decided to fly back instead and I was asked for my tourist card at the airport. An hour wait in some office and a few forms solved that problem - the lack of a passport was never an issue and I didn't even have to offer a bribe.
Charlie Hammond - 22 Apr 2004 20:05 GMT >your concerns are exaggerated, at least with respect to Americans in Mexico. >The only danger nowadays is trouble getting back into the U.S., especially >if one appears hispanic or middle-eastern. That doesn't sould like an exaggerated concern to me!?
> ... Heck, when I was >really young and foolish, I went to Mexico without any identification at >all, mainly so I could honestly claim to the customs inspector that I didn't >have my ID when he questioned whether I was old enough to bring the booze >back into the U.S. It worked. Some might consider you still foolish to admit this in a public forum.
> ... The only time I ever worried about lack >of documentation was the time I took the train down to Mexico City and the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >office and a few forms solved that problem - the lack of a passport was >never an issue and I didn't even have to offer a bribe. About 2-3 years ago my wife worked in Mexico City for about six months. Based on the experiences that she and her colleagues (US and Mexica citizens) reported, I find it nearly unbelievable that you could get ANYthing "offical" done without, perhaps not a "bribe", but, shall we say an "unoffical payment". This is the accepted norm in much or Latin America, probably in much of the world. You are not "bribing" the official to do something "wrong"; just facilitating the flow of paperwork. It should not be considered dishonest.
 Signature Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Dillon Pyron - 22 Apr 2004 21:00 GMT <snip>
>> ... The only time I ever worried about lack >>of documentation was the time I took the train down to Mexico City and the [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >official to do something "wrong"; just facilitating the flow of paperwork. >It should not be considered dishonest. They are known as facilitation fees to the IRS. Yes, there is a space on the corporate tax return for "fees paid to foreign officials".
 Signature dillon
When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob.
Greg Mossman - 22 Apr 2004 22:27 GMT > >your concerns are exaggerated, at least with respect to Americans in Mexico. > >The only danger nowadays is trouble getting back into the U.S., especially > >if one appears hispanic or middle-eastern. > > That doesn't sould like an exaggerated concern to me!? It's not. INS isn't really interested in keeping real Americans out of the country. Most Americans can eventually prove who they are.
> Some might consider you still foolish to admit this in a public forum. Why? It would have been foolish were I still stuck in Mexico 17 years later. But, like I said, it worked. Two cheap bottles of tequila and no fake ID necessary.
> About 2-3 years ago my wife worked in Mexico City for about six months. > Based on the experiences that she and her colleagues (US and Mexica [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > official to do something "wrong"; just facilitating the flow of paperwork. > It should not be considered dishonest. Nope, I was just testing the system. It took me 15 minutes watching the receptionist finish doing her nails before she would even call "el jefe". A few bucks to her would have put her nails on hold. El jefe likewise made me wait a long time and I'm sure a bribe would have facilitated his progress as well. But I was in no hurry, plus I was obviously sick, so whether they actually pitied me or just didn't want to catch whatever I had, they got me out of there soon enough. Also, I was fluent in Spanish at the time, a talent which I've unfortunately lost over the years. I'm sure that helped a bit.
Dillon Pyron - 23 Apr 2004 04:25 GMT >> >your concerns are exaggerated, at least with respect to Americans in >Mexico. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > >> Some might consider you still foolish to admit this in a public forum. Statute of limitations has long since run. Why not confess? Besides, it was actually germane to the thread (what a shocker)
>Why? It would have been foolish were I still stuck in Mexico 17 years >later. But, like I said, it worked. Two cheap bottles of tequila and no >fake ID necessary. Two bottles of cheap tequila? I hope by now you've learned that if you're going to break the law, break it big :-)
>> About 2-3 years ago my wife worked in Mexico City for about six months. >> Based on the experiences that she and her colleagues (US and Mexica [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >talent which I've unfortunately lost over the years. I'm sure that helped a >bit. Knowing the local language is a particularly useful "skill". I learned a while back that sometimes it's to your advantage to act dumb and listen up.
 Signature dillon
When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob.
Greg Mossman - 23 Apr 2004 06:28 GMT > Two bottles of cheap tequila? I hope by now you've learned that if > you're going to break the law, break it big :-) No, no. Two liters is the legal limit and I was walking through. Not much chance of sneaking anything more.
The only time I ever brought back more than the legal limit was the time we stayed in Ensenada and the hotel charged us extra since we were four in the room (two couples) instead of two. Since we had no credit card on deposit, we broke open the minibar and emptied the contents. This happened to be the treasure trove of minibars, containing over 60 mini bottles of miscellaneous booze. I'm certain that our haul exceeded the 2 liter limit, but ya gotta lie sometimes.
And yes, the statute of limitations better be expired. We didn't kill anyone for godssake. Again, I was under 21 and plead youthful exuberance as the cause.
> Knowing the local language is a particularly useful "skill". I > learned a while back that sometimes it's to your advantage to act dumb > and listen up. Heck yeah. I'm gonna start my online Thai lessons six months before my upcoming trip in December. Those unsuspecting Thais won't know what hit them.
Jer - 23 Apr 2004 04:34 GMT >>your concerns are exaggerated, at least with respect to Americans in Mexico. >>The only danger nowadays is trouble getting back into the U.S., especially [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > official to do something "wrong"; just facilitating the flow of paperwork. > It should not be considered dishonest. It is my understanding a notario mellows out quite a bit after they've made their first ten million pesos.
 Signature jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273 "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Dillon Pyron - 22 Apr 2004 17:43 GMT >> Hi All, >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> problem getting in or out of Cozumel with my stepdaughters' birth >> certificates; my husband and I have valid passports, however. <snip>
>> I certainly hope things are still as it reads under the "Entry Requirements" >> or it will truly be a major pain trying to get passports for my stepdaughters >> as they live the majority of the year out of state, and you must apply in >> person for a passport. Please note that Mexico requires a notarized letter for permission to be with one parent if they are not accompanied by both. Since it sounds like you are not the custodial parent, I encourage you to contact the nearest Mexican consulate and get this and other entry questions answered.
>Incorrect. > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >the returning-to-USA internment end. A passport to prevent these >inconveniences is the world's cheapest insurance...less than $10/year! A passport opens the whole world of travel. We always take our passports to Hawai'i, just in case we get the bug to go on to Fiji or Tahiti. Why not have it?
>Third, I personally find it _very_ hard to believe that appearing in >person can even be claimed to be a "major pain". There are so many [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >hassles is when you wait until the last minute and have to go to one of >the 48-hour turnaround service centers. Passports are worth every penny. I won't go anywhere without them. They are great for identification at the airport. The TSA drones know exactly where to look for the information on a passport, as opposed to having to study your out of state driver's license for your name and picture. The less time I have to deal with them the better.
My neice recently got her passport for a trip to Europe this summer. They live in a city of 1500 and she had no problems getting the passport. It took about 3 weeks.
>Fourth, their living out of state for most of the year shouldn't be an >issue at all. [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > >-hh
 Signature dillon
When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob.
Charlie Hammond - 22 Apr 2004 19:54 GMT >Please note that Mexico requires a notarized letter for permission to >be with one parent if they are not accompanied by both. Since it >sounds like you are not the custodial parent, I encourage you to >contact the nearest Mexican consulate and get this and other entry >questions answered. An excellent point.
Mexico is not the only country that has such requirements. I some cases it is a good idea to have such a notarized document whenever a minor child is traveling without both parents accompanying. Even for domestic travel. This is also useful for a minor child traveling with someone who is NOT his/her parent -- e.g. a reltive or "friend of the family". Such a document can also give the accompanying person authority to authorize emergency medical care.
This is an area where it is good to consult an attorney who is knowledgable in this area.
 Signature Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Jer - 23 Apr 2004 04:38 GMT [....]
> Passports are worth every penny. I won't go anywhere without them. > They are great for identification at the airport. The TSA drones know > exactly where to look for the information on a passport, as opposed to > having to study your out of state driver's license for your name and > picture. The less time I have to deal with them the better. Sans a driver's license, a passport is the only photo ID I own, and use it regularly for domestic and foreign travel.
[....]
 Signature jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273 "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Charlie Hammond - 26 Apr 2004 15:13 GMT >Sans a driver's license, a passport is the only photo ID I own, and use >it regularly for domestic and foreign travel. Most if not all USA state departments of motor vehicles (which may be know by slightly different names in various states) will issue a non-driver's license photo ID. Costs and required proofs of identity will vary. Check with your state.
It can be a lot easier to carry and use such a card for USA domestic ID purpose, rather than a passport. It may also be easier to replace such an ID if lost.
 Signature Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Jer - 26 Apr 2004 15:30 GMT >>Sans a driver's license, a passport is the only photo ID I own, and use >>it regularly for domestic and foreign travel. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > purpose, rather than a passport. It may also be easier to replace > such an ID if lost. All good points, but outside of traveling, I so rarely need any ID, it's not been a problem. It helps to understand that I operate my life under the radar of most issues that plague others - I don't really do anything that requires a photo ID on a regular basis. Nobody argues with cash, not even a cabbie.
 Signature jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273 "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Greg Mossman - 26 Apr 2004 23:57 GMT > All good points, but outside of traveling, I so rarely need any ID, it's > not been a problem. It helps to understand that I operate my life under > the radar of most issues that plague others - I don't really do anything > that requires a photo ID on a regular basis. Nobody argues with cash, > not even a cabbie. Using a credit card rarely plagues me. It just ain't that hard to pull the ID out of my wallet if they want to see it. And I get air miles.
Jer - 27 Apr 2004 14:22 GMT >>All good points, but outside of traveling, I so rarely need any ID, it's >>not been a problem. It helps to understand that I operate my life under [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Using a credit card rarely plagues me. It just ain't that hard to pull the > ID out of my wallet if they want to see it. And I get air miles. Uh uh, the air miles scam - you got me there. :)
 Signature jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273 "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Dillon Pyron - 26 Apr 2004 15:31 GMT >>Sans a driver's license, a passport is the only photo ID I own, and use >>it regularly for domestic and foreign travel. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >purpose, rather than a passport. It may also be easier to replace >such an ID if lost. I once had a TSA agent spend a good two minutes looking at my out fo state DL, looking for the pertinent data.
Of course, I did qualify the above statment by saying he was TSA.
 Signature dillon
When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob.
H. Huntzinger - 28 Apr 2004 12:37 GMT > Most if not all USA state departments of motor vehicles (which may be know > by slightly different names in various states) will issue a non-driver's > license photo ID. Costs and required proofs of identity will vary. In New Jersey, they're in the process of going to a new "secure" digital ID/Licence and have gone to rediculous extremes in their requirements to prove who you are in order to get one.
Bottom line is that in NJ, we pretty much need a Passport today to have enough "points" in NJ's crazy new system in order to get merely the State ID/Licence.
Plus your Birth Certificate.
Plus a Utility Bill.
-hh
Charlie Hammond - 28 Apr 2004 16:51 GMT >> Most if not all USA state departments of motor vehicles (which may be know >> by slightly different names in various states) will issue a non-driver's [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Plus a Utility Bill. An utility bill? An [explative delted] UTILITY bill???!!!
Kinda makes one wonder what you'll have to go through the next time you sign up for Electric, Gas or Water service in a new home.
I surrender. The terrorist HAVE won.
 Signature Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Joe English - 29 Apr 2004 02:05 GMT >>>Most if not all USA state departments of motor vehicles (which may be know >>>by slightly different names in various states) will issue a non-driver's [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > An utility bill? An [explative delted] UTILITY bill???!!! You gave up long before the utility bill!
> Kinda makes one wonder what you'll have to go through the next > time you sign up for Electric, Gas or Water service in a new home. > > I surrender. The terrorist HAVE won. Jer - 29 Apr 2004 09:18 GMT >>Most if not all USA state departments of motor vehicles (which may be know >>by slightly different names in various states) will issue a non-driver's [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > -hh What th...? You mean you gotta be a adult resident to get a NJ state ID? Well I dee-clare!!
 Signature jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273 "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Geoff - 22 Apr 2004 17:51 GMT >Third, I personally find it _very_ hard to believe that appearing in >person can even be claimed to be a "major pain". It is if they don't live with that parent and the ex is resistant to doing this for the sake of the other.
Charlie Hammond - 22 Apr 2004 20:35 GMT >>Third, I personally find it _very_ hard to believe that appearing in >>person can even be claimed to be a "major pain". > >It is if they don't live with that parent and the ex is resistant to >doing this for the sake of the other. I hope I am overreacting to this, but what you say makes it sound like the non-custodial parent is trying to take the child out of the country without the custodial parent's permission. See a lawyer. Soon. If you do this you could EASILY get into a situation where having a passport or not is simply no longer the important issue.
 Signature Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.
Geoff - 23 Apr 2004 07:32 GMT >>>Third, I personally find it _very_ hard to believe that appearing in >>>person can even be claimed to be a "major pain". [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >If you do this you could EASILY get into a situation where having a >passport or not is simply no longer the important issue. I'm sure you are overreacting to it. If you will reread the OP's post you will see she is trying to take the step kids on vacation with them to Cozumel and is concerned about the US Dept. of State's description that "The Government of Mexico requires...", etc. It's not inconceivable that her spouse's ex-wife might be resistant to taking the kids down to the post office to get pix and forms for passports so they can enjoy their vacation. All this is speculation.
Jess Englewood - 22 Apr 2004 22:19 GMT > > I certainly hope things are still as it reads under the "Entry Requirements" > > or it will truly be a major pain trying to get passports for my stepdaughters [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > First, only Minors are required to appear in person, and only if they're > under age 14, Having been thru all this over the years with my oldest, and recently..after 9/11, with my youngest child, I know that someone applying for a passport must appear in person if: 1) you are under 17 years old (under 14 just has additional requirements) 2) this is your first passport, regardless of age 3) you are not in possession of your previous passport, regardless of age 4) your previous passport expired xx years ago (don't remember the exact term) 5) you have a name change you can't prove (or something like that) 6) you previous passport was issued before your 17th birthday, regardless of your current age
Basically the only people who can apply without appearing are those whose old passports were issued as adults, those who still have their passports in possession and those who haven't had any name changes they are unable to document.
Both her kids have to appear in person.
Drew M. Mooney - 13 Jul 2004 13:47 GMT Be advised, depending on the age of your child, passport expiration could be much less than 10 years...apparently they expire in about as much time it takes for their identifying photograph to become useless. I think for very young children [2-5?] it's 2 year expiry. [I know because I was shocked to see that my daughter's passport expired, and it hasn't been anywhere near 10 years since we got it...]
This plays hell with your $10/year math, but otherwise I agree with everything you say.
-drew-
> > Hi All, > > [quoted text clipped - 64 lines] > > -hh Gat'rBait - 14 Jul 2004 04:00 GMT We needed passports in 2001 when we went to Coz
JOhn ><>
> Be advised, depending on the age of your child, passport expiration could be > much less than 10 years...apparently they expire in about as much time it [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > " H. Huntzinger" <{NOSPAM-rm_to_reply}rec-scuba@huntzinger.com> wrote in > message news:{NOSPAM-rm_to_reply}rec-scuba-92F12E.07492722042004@news-east.ash.giganews.com...
> > > Hi All, > > > [quoted text clipped - 71 lines] > > > > -hh Dillon Pyron - 14 Jul 2004 20:27 GMT >We needed passports in 2001 when we went to Coz Last time we visited CZM (June of 2003) not having passports was not a problem. We had ours of course, but there didn't seem to be any problem for people with other proofs of citizenship.
All of the preceeding, of course, only applies to US nationals. I believe the same also applies to Canadians, but it's best to check first.
As I and others have posted, it never hurts to have a passport. And an envelope stuff with $1000 each of Euros, Yen and a few other currencies. There's no telling when you may need to leave the country "in a hurry".
>JOhn ><> > [quoted text clipped - 94 lines] >> > >> > -hh
 Signature dillon
When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob.
Greg Mossman - 16 Jul 2004 23:40 GMT > As I and others have posted, it never hurts to have a passport. And > an envelope stuff with $1000 each of Euros, Yen and a few other > currencies. There's no telling when you may need to leave the country > "in a hurry". You've got to be kidding. U.S. dollars are accepted everywhere.
Jer - 17 Jul 2004 14:34 GMT >>As I and others have posted, it never hurts to have a passport. And >>an envelope stuff with $1000 each of Euros, Yen and a few other >>currencies. There's no telling when you may need to leave the country >>"in a hurry". > > You've got to be kidding. U.S. dollars are accepted everywhere. That depends on whether the receiver agrees to take the hit on the exchange rate and fee. Some won't, so I always have a supply of the local currency.
 Signature jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Greg Mossman - 17 Jul 2004 20:42 GMT > That depends on whether the receiver agrees to take the hit on the > exchange rate and fee. Some won't, so I always have a supply of the > local currency. By keeping a supply of local currency, your supply is constantly subject to the whims devaluation. Much better to change it as you need it, or simply use U.S. dollars and negotiate well so neither of you take a hit. Of course if your "supply" is a few hundred bucks worth and you're complaining about a hit of a couple bucks, then we obviously aren't talking about the same thing.
Jer - 17 Jul 2004 21:25 GMT >>That depends on whether the receiver agrees to take the hit on the >>exchange rate and fee. Some won't, so I always have a supply of the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > hit of a couple bucks, then we obviously aren't talking about the same > thing. I could never expect my employees to exchange their cash pay, despite minor changes in devaluations. My supply is significantly more than a few hundred whatevers and typically kept in a local bank. Yes, we're talking apples and oranges here - tourists buying trinkets and food or paying for someone's livelihood are two different kettles of fish. Sorry, I didn't intend to confuse anyone.
 Signature jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Joe English - 22 Apr 2004 13:01 GMT > Hi All, > [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > http://www.scubagrl.net > Passports not required
Jer - 22 Apr 2004 13:45 GMT > Hi All, > [quoted text clipped - 42 lines] > http://www.scubagrl.net > Nancy, it's not required, but please get all the kids a passport. Nobody wants to stand in line behind a family digging through a bagfull of vacation trinkets, half-eaten sandwiches and loose papers with jelly stains trying to convince this week's desk clerk that the oldest one isn't the son of OBL. One day, INS may get a clue and have a queue for non-passport returnees only. You can take all afternoon if you want while the rest of the world breezes through to catch their connecting flights.
 Signature jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' ICQ = 35253273 "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
Jess Englewood - 22 Apr 2004 22:30 GMT > Nancy, it's not required, but please get all the kids a passport. > Nobody wants to stand in line behind a family digging through a bagfull > of vacation trinkets, half-eaten sandwiches and loose papers with jelly > stains trying to convince this week's desk clerk that the oldest one > isn't the son of OBL. Good points. Happened to us once returning thru Tijuana/San Diego. Had gone over to visit relatives and show off our new baby girl. When coming back we had a major hassle because we did not have a passport for the baby. Their concern was that we had bought, taken, borrowed, whatever, a Mexican baby and were bringing her back illegally. The problem was a passport would have a picture and the birth cert obviously didn't. Took a while to get thru. The Tijuana crossing was far more strigent than the Juarez crossing we were used to.
I imagine the people behind us were plain tired of hearing La Bomba sang 1500 times by the local kids, while waiting for us to get cleared thru. Luckily they were all quite nice about it. This was 25+ years ago but I learned then to be prepared not only for ourselves but for the others around us.
Geoff - 22 Apr 2004 17:59 GMT >... my stepdaughters with us, who are now 14 and 18. The minor can travel without passport if accompanied by the custodial parent. The 18 year old will be required to have a passport to reenter the US.
Post-9/11 you know. Them terrorists can disguise themselves as pretty 18 year old girls to get past those brave eagle-eyed INS dudes.
Greg Mossman - 22 Apr 2004 19:18 GMT > The 18 year old will be required to have a passport to > reenter the US. Bullshit.
Dillon Pyron - 22 Apr 2004 21:04 GMT >> The 18 year old will be required to have a passport to >> reenter the US. > >Bullshit. Agreed. Last trip to Cozumel we were told all an adult needed was an official birth certificate and a government issued photo ID. Minors (I think under 16, not sure) only need the birth certificate.
Please note, this must be an official birth certificate with the raised seal. Photo copies not accepted.
 Signature dillon
When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob.
Geoff - 23 Apr 2004 07:59 GMT >> The 18 year old will be required to have a passport to >> reenter the US. > >Bullshit. Not at all. You also snipped my facetious comment that followed.
As an adult you may choose to bribe whomever you like and spend as much time and money as you like testing the systems to see what you can get away with. The OP I am sure just wants to take her step daughters on a nice hassle-free vacation and wants to know how hard she's going to have to work to do it. I inferred from her post that she wants to either minimize the hassle at the ex-spouses end of it or wants to minimize the amount of work all around to see that they have a nice vacation. I'm sure she also doesn't want to have to stand and explain all that to some Mexican or INS official at either end.
Here's the official US Dept. of State advice on the topic. http://travel.state.gov/mexico.html
http://travel.state.gov/ppt_faq.html#ca66
Geoff - 23 Apr 2004 08:07 GMT >>> The 18 year old will be required to have a passport to >>> reenter the US. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >http://travel.state.gov/ppt_faq.html#ca66 http://travel.state.gov/yourtripabroad.html
Greg Mossman - 23 Apr 2004 18:22 GMT > >Bullshit. > > Not at all. You also snipped my facetious comment that followed. I don't read facetious comments. But when I read your bullshit about how a passport is required to re-enter the U.S., I couldn't help calling it bullshit. The 18-year-old needs a birth certificate and government-issued photo ID, plain and simple. A passport is nice but it is not required. You said it was required. That's bullshit.
> http://travel.state.gov/mexico.html That's quite a mouthful. Were you referring to the part which reads, "A number of facilities have opened in Mexico that offer behavior modification therapy for teenagers and others suffering from drug addiction and other behavioral or psychological problems. Standards applied by the Government of Mexico and local governments, where they exist, may not meet standards for similar facilities in the United States . Parents planning to enroll their children in these facilities should take appropriate action to investigate the facility first."? No, I didn't think so.
Or were you simply referring to the part where "the U.S. Embassy recommends traveling with a valid U.S. passport to avoid delays or misunderstandings" because that sounds an awful like a recommendation to me and not a requirement and it speaks of traveling within Mexico not re-entering the U.S. Can you even read?
BTW, if you did read the entire state department line of bullshit about any particular country, you'd never leave the U.S.
In Mexico, for example: "Crime in Mexico continues at high levels, and it is often violent", "Sporadic outbursts of politically motivated violence occur from time to time in certain parts of the country", "Some segments of the local population resent the presence of foreigners and openly express their hostility", "There are a significant number of pick-pocketing incidents, purse snatchings and hotel-room thefts", "Armed street crime is a serious problem in all of the major cities", "Some establishments may contaminate or drug the drinks to gain control over the patron", "Victims, who are almost always unaccompanied, have been raped, robbed of personal property, or abducted and then held while their credit cards were used at various businesses and Automatic Teller Machines (ATMs)", "U.S. citizens should be very cautious in general when using ATMs in Mexico", "Kidnapping, including the kidnapping of non-Mexicans, continues at alarming rates", "Criminal assaults occur on highways throughout Mexico", "there have been several reports of bus hijackings and robberies on "toll" roads", "In some instances, Americans have become victims of harassment, mistreatment and extortion by Mexican law enforcement", "Tourists should not hike alone in backcountry areas, nor walk alone on lightly frequented beaches, ruins or trails", " In many areas in Mexico , tap water is unsafe and should be avoided", "Visitors to Mexico , especially in urban areas, should exercise particular caution when crossing streets", "Mexican authorities may prosecute anyone arrested for transporting aliens into or out of Mexico", "There have been a significant number of rapes reported in Cancun", "Diving equipment provided by dive shops may not meet U.S. safety standards and due to frequent use, may be substandard or defective", "If black flags are up, do not enter the water", "Two volcanoes in Mexico have been active in recent years". Don't forget, this comes from the same people who told us there were WMD in Iraq, so you know it must be true.
And you're trying to worry the poor lady over a passport? What kind of parent is she, anyway, taking her children to such a dangerous country?
geraldp - 22 Apr 2004 20:40 GMT Hi Nancy:
> Hi All, > > I was recently told by a fellow scuba diver that now everyone (children > included) now need passports to enter Cozumel from the U.S. .
> Anyone have thoughts or updates on this and can reference their information? > > Thanks a lot in advance for any and all help here! > > Nancy Hi Nancy:
As of February of this year they were not required. However the gals in our group that tried to get in with just a birth certificate and drivers license were hassled because their maiden names on the birth certificate didn't match their names on their DL. They were told they should also bring a marriage license, or some other proof of name-change. They got in OK, but there was a delay.
Also all the children in our group had photo ID in addition to a birth certificates. If you don't get them passports I would recomend bringing an official photo id as well as their birth certificate. We got ours at the local DMV.
Jerry
Joe English - 22 Apr 2004 22:54 GMT > Hi Nancy: > [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > Jerry For kids - a picture school id will work - schools are considered government entities. (I think this works for both public and private schools)
Jess Englewood - 22 Apr 2004 23:06 GMT > > Also all the children in our group had photo ID in addition to a birth > > certificates. If you don't get them passports I would recomend bringing [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > government entities. (I think this works for both public and private > schools) This must be a fairly recent change because my youngest had to get a State ID card from the motor vehicle station. The passport office would not accept her school ID.
Joe English - 23 Apr 2004 02:10 GMT >>>Also all the children in our group had photo ID in addition to a birth >>>certificates. If you don't get them passports I would recomend bringing [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > ID card from the motor vehicle station. The passport office would not accept > her school ID. Last year - going out of the country (may)
Jer - 14 Jul 2004 12:01 GMT >>>Also all the children in our group had photo ID in addition to a birth >>>certificates. If you don't get them passports I would recomend bringing [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > ID card from the motor vehicle station. The passport office would not accept > her school ID. I'm not surprised, a school ID would only be valid for the short time the student was enrolled.
I'm convinced the lack of passport enforcement for Mexico visits is largely due to pressure from a variety of entertainment and business entities on the state dept. Call it a "good neighbour fence" without a lockable gate.
 Signature jer email reply - I am not a 'ten' "All that we do is touched with ocean, yet we remain on the shore of what we know." -- Richard Wilbur
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