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Scuba Forum / Scuba Locations / September 2009Spaces on luxury Red Sea Trip in October
Our club has a few spaces available on the Red Sea Liveaboard ‘MV Tiger Lilly’ for a one week diving liveaboard holiday in October this year. Boat details: www.divetours.co.uk/destinations/redsea/liveaboard/tigerlily.htm or www.olympicholidays.com/diving-holidays/red-sea/liveaboards/sharm-el-sheikh-tige r-lily.html. The trip is from 16th October to the 23rd and is fully inclusive of flights from Gatwick, full-board and FREE NITROX. This is primarily a wreck dive trip, covering the 'normal' wrecks such as the Thistlegorm, Carnatic, Giannis D, etc., but also the deeper wrecks of the Rosalie Muller and hopefully, weather permitting, also travelling further south to the Brothers. We can cater for all qualification levels of diving from novice through to technical & there will be at least three divers on closed circuit rebreathers (including myself and Linda my wife), therefore Sofnolime, O2 and bail-out cylinders can be made available at additional cost. The cost of this excellent trip is only £879, including fuel surcharge, which makes this a bargain! Regards, Tony Howard SameSameDiving.com tony@samesamediving.com >Our club has a few spaces available on the Red Sea Liveaboard MV Tiger >Lilly for a one week diving liveaboard holiday in October this year. [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >The cost of this excellent trip is only £879, including fuel surcharge, >which makes this a bargain! Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now. > >Our club has a few spaces available on the Red Sea Liveaboard ‘MV Tiger > >Lilly’ for a one week diving liveaboard holiday in October this year. [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now.- Hide quoted text - Maybe it's a spam surcharge. Spam costs more per gallon. > Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now. Maybe in your world. In mine, it's quite a bit higher than that. I'm pretty sure regular is still above $2.50, I saw some midgrade as low as $2.75 yesterday. High test is running close to $3.00. No matter what grade you like, there's a fuel surcharge for marine use. Lee >> Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Lee Firstly,near all boats use diesel not 'gas' or petrol and secondly the current price of diesel in England is about £1.07 per litre, with petrol being a little less Why do Americans believe that the rest of the world pays the same as you? Fuel in the US has always been, and still is, much cheaper than in most other parts of the world. NB. The US gallon is smaller than the UK or 'standard' gallon. Therefore an accurate comparison would be the litre measure, as this is based on the worldwide standard SI measure of volume. The US gallon is only 3.79 litres compared to a UK gallon which is 4.54 litres. This is because, although we both have a gallon as 8 pints, a US pint is only 16 US fluid ounces compared to the UK pint of 20 UK fluid ounces. Based upon your average cost of $2.5 per us gallon that means you are paying about 66 cents per litre, whereas in the UK we are paying about USD$1.72 per litre, over two and a half times the cost of your fuel! That means that a US gallon of fuel of 3.79 litres is about £4.05 in England or USD$6.5, not the USD$2.5 you're paying. Even in Europe, although a bit lower than the UK, the cost of diesel is still much higher than the US, with a litre of diesel in France at about 1.06 Euro, that makes the cost of a US gallon around USD$5.6, still much higher. And you wonder why we are always complaining? This is because we're being ripped off by the oil giants and also on the extortionate taxes! BTW, the exchange rates I used were based on today's rate on www.xe.com of 1 Euro = 1.39755 USD and 1 GB Pound = 1.6106 USD. Tony >>> Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now. >> [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > Tony The price you pay for gas in the UK... how much of that is Tax?!?! Invisible68 >>>> Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now. >>> [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > > Invisible68 Most! > Firstly,near all boats use diesel not 'gas' or petrol and secondly the > current price of diesel in England is about £1.07 per litre, with petrol > being a little less Fair enough - - but isn't the diveboat in question in the (ahem) Red Sea? As such, isn't the correct question to ask be what the price of fuel is over in Egypt? > Why do Americans believe that the rest of the world pays the same as > you? Fuel in the US has always been, and still is, much cheaper than in > most other parts of the world. Capitalism will force the price of the fuel to be the same. What differs is the magnitude of the local tax that is added. Many USA residents (perhaps even "most") don't necessiarly realize or appreciate the magnitude of the local taxes (eg. VAT) added on fuel in many European countries in particular. > The US gallon is only 3.79 litres... > > Based upon your average cost of $2.5 per us gallon that means you are > paying about 66 cents per litre, whereas in the UK we are paying about > USD$1.72 per litre, over two and a half times the cost of your fuel! As per citation (unfortunately, from May 2008): <http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5iCdeo7jySx2GuIbjIbgZwHqFnXNg> ...it states that the price of diesel in Egypt was going to increase costs by 46% for diesel, which would put it at 1.10 Egyptian pounds...aka 20 US cents .. per liter. Based on today's currency exchange: 1.00 USD = 5.58765 EGP ...the current value of that 2008 price would be 1.10/5.58765 = $ 0.1968, which is still roughly 20 US cents per liter. > BTW, the exchange rates I used were based on today's rate onwww.xe.com > of 1 Euro = 1.39755 USD and 1 GB Pound = 1.6106 USD. Using that conversion, the 2008 price in Egypt was roughly 0.124 GBP/ liter. Now while its entirely possible that the prices in Egypt have quadrupled within the past year ... which would bring them up to roughly US$ 3/gallon, or 0.5 GBP/liter ... I suspect that we would be able to find such a news article within Google. -hh This is all rather academic, as the only price that matters is the local pump price, including all local taxes. News item: (Egypt doubles price of fuel) http://news.egypt.com/en/200801031270/news/-egypt-news/diesel-fuel-prices-increa sed-100-in-egypt.html That still means that there has been significant increases in the cost of fuel since the cost of the dive trip was originally calculated and published in the tour operators catalogue last year. When you have a 120ft liveaboard boat with two VERY large engines and three compressors operating for an entire week, covering hundreds of nautical miles, any cost increase will be significant. I don't really understand why you're harping on this point anyway, unless of course you want to book any places on the trip :-), otherwise it won't affect you. Also, I'm only a customer, not the booking agent or boat owner, and I'm only passing on this message and trying to be as complete with the info as possible including the full cost of this trip, WHICH IS STILL VERY CHEAP compared to other similar trips! We need to close this particular matter and, as I did not make these prices, they were from our tour operator and boat owner, so I can't answer any more on this specific issue, but I would be happy to discuss the more pertinent details of the diving if anyone is really serious about making a booking. Regards, Tony. > This is all rather academic, as the only price that matters > is the local pump price, including all local taxes. Exactly, which is why I was pointing out that your statements of "local" (to you) fuel prices in UK are utterly irrelevant to the price at the pump in Egypt. > News item: (Egypt doubles price of fuel)http://news.egypt.com/en/200801031270/news/-egypt-news/diesel-fuel-pr... Sorry, but that article is Feb 2008, which makes it even older than the May 08 article that I previously quoted. So not only was your reported price increase already incorporated into what I worked up, but I had also worked in the next reported *planned* price increase. > That still means that there has been significant increases in the cost > of fuel since the cost of the dive trip was originally calculated and > published in the tour operators catalogue last year. Which was when? (ie, before or after the Feb 08 price increase) > When you have a 120ft liveaboard boat with two VERY large engines and > three compressors operating for an entire week, covering hundreds of > nautical miles, any cost increase will be significant. Academically, let's assume 2 gallons per mile, a 1000 mile trip, 20 guests to amortize the cost across, and the latest (and highest) fuel cost we've been able to document, namely 1.10 Egyptian pounds...aka 20 US cents .. per liter) That's roughly (2 gal/mi)*(~4L/gal)*(1000mi)*(1/20guests)*($0.20/L) = $80/guest. But....note that this is the entire cost of all the fuel at today's prices, meaning that it already includes said "big price increase". Backing out the reported May 08 projected increase of 46%, it means that the "before" price was $55/guest, which means that the fuel surcharge is but $25. Of course, if the live-aboard isn't sailing the 1000 miles assumed above, then the numbers come down. Simplistically, if its a 500 mile itinerary, then the fuel surcharge would be around $12.50/person. > I don't really understand why you're harping on this point anyway, > unless of course you want to book any places on the trip :-), otherwise > it won't affect you. Because I recognize that last minute fills of club-organized charters can be a good deal, and how such vacancies are handled can provide guidance as to how good the club is. Even if I can't go on this one, there will be future trips and future vacancies. Plus I don't think that an extra $20 here or there is particularly profound to the cost of such a trip. > Also, I'm only a customer, not the booking agent or boat owner, and I'm > only passing on this message and trying to be as complete with the info > as possible including the full cost of this trip, WHICH IS STILL VERY > CHEAP compared to other similar trips! And here I thought you said "Our Club has a few spaces...", which indicates that you do have an interest. > We need to close this particular matter and, as I did not make these > prices, they were from our tour operator and boat owner, so I can't > answer any more on this specific issue, but I would be happy to discuss > the more pertinent details of the diving if anyone is really serious > about making a booking. Actually, if your club chartered the entire boat, then your club is who chooses the price. And the club can choose to discount the vacancies to whatever price they want in order to minimize your members' cost increases ... that's typically why a club tries to fill such vacancies. Afterall, if the club wasn't potentially looking at incurring a cost increase for their own members, then why wouldn't the club wish to not have a potentially more pleasant week from having a less crowded boat? In any event, I'll see what your club's asking price is in another 45 days, and if it has been simplified yet to a simple "pay one price", whatever that may be...and if its organizers have realized yet that they very well may want to discount the excess inventory to below what they're paying for themselves (because 1/2 is better than none). Presently, the £879 doesn't appear to have been discounted at all versus what I can book right now on my own. -hh Egypt has subsidized the prices of many commodities for residents and businesses including the price of bread and the price of fuel. Over the past year, they have reduced these subsidies (causing protests and demonstrations) and may continue to do so in the future. The price of anything in Egypt is in flux, and is subject to the political whims of the government and the economic realities of the market. I don't think it's unreasonable for any dive or boat operator to indicate that there may be a fuel surcharge, given the current conditions. Other countries have similar issues. Sometimes you just can't pin these things down. Overall, I have found Egypt to be an outstanding dive value for the money; with or without fuel surcharges. > > This is all rather academic, as the only price that matters > > is the local pump price, including all local taxes. [quoted text clipped - 83 lines] > > -hh >... I don't > think it's unreasonable for any dive or boat operator to indicate that > there may be a fuel surcharge, given the current conditions.... Agreed, but its not the dive boat operator who's here promoting the product, but rather, an intermediary. -hh HH, Unless you want to book a place on our trip why are you spending so much time on being pedantic about what is a relatively a small increase in what is still very well priced! Get a life! Oh, and BTW, the price increase is directly charged by the owner of the fleet of boats, not me, my club or even the UK based travel agent. These surcharges started last year, so are not a new issue. My wife and I are paying exactly the same costs as anyone else, and therefore I don’t have any interest in this in the form of any remuneration, we simply want to fill spare spaces. One of the main reasons for this trip is that two of our members are having an underwater wedding and I don’t think that we would want someone as boring, tight-fisted and pretentious as you on our trip as it would spoil our enjoyment and the camaraderie our club has grown over the last 12 years. Please desist from responding to this message as I won’t continue this thread. Anyone who is genuinely interested in the trip or making a booking is welcome to contact me. Tony > HH, > > Unless you want to book a place on our trip why are you spending so much > time on being pedantic about what is a relatively a small increase in > what is still very well priced! Because it is curious as to why you're being so persistent in promoting a trip that's not even discounted one shilling from the current online price...and claims of zero financial interests. > One of the main reasons for this trip is that two of our members are > having an underwater wedding ... If there's a wedding, then why are you trying to fill the boat (with complete strangers, no less)? > ... and I don’t think that we would want > someone as boring, tight-fisted and pretentious as you on our trip as it > would spoil our enjoyment and the camaraderie our club has grown over > the last 12 years. Sorry, but I only photograph weddings for free if its family. > Please desist from responding to this message as I won’t continue this > thread. > > Anyone who is genuinely interested in the trip or making a booking is > welcome to contact me. And yet again with the sales pitch. Thanks, but I'd rather book direct. -hh Haha. Poor u. Pinky. a.s. Here in KSA the. Diesel price is umm around 6 cent $ I think Im Gona buy that boat. Haha >>> Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now. >> [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > >Tony Haha. Poor u. Pinky. a.s. Here in KSA the. Diesel price is umm around 6 cent $ I think Im Gona buy that boat. Haha >>> Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now. >> [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > >Tony >> Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Lee $2.44 per gal of regular... and $2.34 for the mid grade (10% ethonal) here in Iowa Invisible68 >>> Fuel surcharge??? Gas is only $2.17 a gallon right now. >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Invisible68 That means that at USD $2.44 per US gallon = about 64.4 cents per litre, or about GBP £0.40. At current UK pump prices of GBP £1.07, that makes a UK litre of Diesel over 2 and a half times the cost in the US, and its only about 20% less in Europe than the UK, so still over twice the cost of fuel in the US. Phew! |
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