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Scuba Forum / General / April 2007Question about CW swim test (PADI)
I just received a PADI kit that I sent for, and it contains virtually all of the test required for both CW and OW testing. It even includes the folder for the instructor's records with check boxes for each skill. As for the swim test, it looks like I have a choice -- 200 yards, or 300 yards with snorkel and fins. I know now that I can do either, but I can cover a lot more water a lot faster with a snorkel and fins. Should I opt for the fastest, easier method, or go with my snail's pace side stroke? Some of you are instructors. Would it make any difference? Thanks. Sheldon > As for the swim test, it looks like I have a choice -- 200 yards, or 300 > yards with snorkel and fins. I know now that I can do either, but I can > cover a lot more water a lot faster with a snorkel and fins. Should I opt > for the fastest, easier method, or go with my snail's pace side stroke? It's a skills test. Either one works as well. You know you can do both, so have nothing to prove to yourself or anyone else. If everyone opts for the snorkel and fins, go with the flow. If people choose each, do whichever you want, or both if you prefer. Lee Makes no difference. As long as your Visa is good you'll pass the swim tests. Brian Edmonton, Alberta > I just received a PADI kit that I sent for, and it contains virtually all of > the test required for both CW and OW testing. It even includes the folder [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Sheldon > Makes no difference. As long as your Visa is good you'll pass the swim > tests. I think he's a citizen so he doesn't need a visa Still LOL LOL :-) > I just received a PADI kit that I sent for, and it contains virtually all of > the test required for both CW and OW testing. It even includes the folder [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Sheldon Your instructor may not offer you a choice. I don't. If you were my student, I'd ask you for a written request to do the snorkel swim. A five pager, with detailed explanation. :-) If there is some physical reason why you cannot complete the swim, I may let you do the snorkel, but at that point you would need to swear to me, to yourself, and to any deity you worship that you will never, ever, ever become one of those divers who rids himself of his snorkel first chance he gets. If you can't swim without your snorkel, you can't BE without your snorkel. Period. kari >> I just received a PADI kit that I sent for, and it contains virtually all >> of [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > kari Good point, but I'm merely thinking more in terms of a time factor. I can ditch the snorkel and still cover a lot more distance faster with fins than without. If I was an instructor I'd probably throw everybody in the deep end of the pool and see what happens. In about two minutes you'd know pretty quick what's what and who is more comfortable in the water. > >> I just received a PADI kit that I sent for, and it contains virtually all > >> of [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > end of the pool and see what happens. In about two minutes you'd know > pretty quick what's what and who is more comfortable in the water. As there is no time limit, what is the time factor? The swim portion will end when the last person is finished... kari I'm not an instructor, but if I were, I would require both swims. First the 200 yards, then a five minute rest, then the 300 yards swim/snorkel. You shouldn't be thinking about diving if you can't swim a little over a quarter mile with a break and no time limit. >> >> I just received a PADI kit that I sent for, and it contains virtually >> >> all [quoted text clipped - 41 lines] > > kari > I'm not an instructor, but if I were, I would require both swims. First the > 200 yards, then a five minute rest, then the 300 yards swim/snorkel. You > shouldn't be thinking about diving if you can't swim a little over a quarter > mile with a break and no time limit. They should also make 'em bench press full al80's for 5 sets of 50 reps right after the swim. Might as well weed out the wimps right from the gitgo. Probably should be a requirement to swim 100' or more underwater on one breath as well. JF >> I'm not an instructor, but if I were, I would require both swims. First >> the [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > the gitgo. Probably should be a requirement to swim 100' or more > underwater on one breath as well. Listen, we accidentally agree on this. Let's not have that happen again. I just started, or ended, as the case may be, a ruckus on the accident list over this statement from an alleged "dive professional": "it must return to the old days when not everyone could dive and we must stop thinking that just because you can breath on a regulator this makes u a diver" > I'm not an instructor, but if I were, I would require both swims. First > the 200 yards, then a five minute rest, then the 300 yards swim/snorkel. > You shouldn't be thinking about diving if you can't swim a little over a > quarter mile with a break and no time limit. I'd require underwater bicycle riding. It's about as necessary to diving as swimming is, and just because you can swim, doesn't mean you can dive. On Apr 10, 7:26 pm, "Douglas W \"Popeye\" Frederick" <Pop...@finalprotectivefire.com> wrote: > > I'm not an instructor, but if I were, I would require both swims. First > > the 200 yards, then a five minute rest, then the 300 yards swim/snorkel. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > It's about as necessary to diving as swimming is, and just because you can > swim, doesn't mean you can dive. Some of the worst students I've had were lifeguards. One of the worst divers I've ever seen was a very good swimmer. Brian Edmonton, Alberta > Some of the worst students I've had were lifeguards. One of the worst > divers I've ever seen was a very good swimmer. Swimming and diving have nothing in common. Common sense and dive instruction have little to do with each other, in most cases. Dive instruction is usually tied to retail sales. There are exceptions to everything blanket. The best tact is to get your learners permit (OW card) and then dive with people who know how the cow eats cabbage. . > Dive instruction is usually tied to retail sales. Kaitlyn started her classes Tuesday evening at the local SSI shop... I drove by the shop on Monday and got signed her up... They said that there was only one other person in the class at that time... One of her school friends had said that his parents were wanting to get him certified because they are going to Grand Cayman this summer and wanted him to be able to dive with them, so I called his parents and spoke with his mother Monday evening and informed her of the very small class and told her that if she was serious about getting him certified, he could catch a ride with us over there since they live in the neighborhood... Turned out that both she and her husband were also wanting to get certified, so I gave them the info on price and what they would need before the class... I warned her about the high pressure sales tactics at the dive shops and how the training was just a way for them to get inexperienced people to buy overpriced gear... I gave them a few lower priced alternatives, in case they wanted to not pay MSRP++ at the local dive shops... I made sure that I warned them about the split fins being a gimick and told them that they couldn't really go wrong with a pair of ScubaPro Jet Fins... We got to the shop about 15 minutes early today and they were there... Buying the package equipment that the shop sells... Basically $400 for a mask, snorkel, fins, defogger, weight belt (perhaps with weights), and mesh dive bag with the shop's name silk screened on it... To top it off, they went with the ScubaPro split fins... I think that the shop charges around $175 for them... Basically $700 per person once you include the cost of the course and required books... Oh well... I tried to warn them... I just got through disassembling Kaitlyn's BC's inflator valve... Seems that one of the O-rings has a slight leak to it and there are very small bubbles escaping from around the button... Sure wish I had a spanner wrench... A pair of needle nose pliers works, but it's not an elegant solution... The O-rings seem in good enough shape... I can't see any nicks on them or anything... Hope it's not a problem with the surface that the seat upon inside the valve... I can't really get a good look inside there to see how smooth the inner surface is on the valve... Probably stop by the plumbing department over at Lowes tomorrow to see if I can find some O-rings that are the right size... It's a small enough leak that if it occurred on my inflator valve, I wouldn't really worry about it, but the instructor mentioned it, so I guess I probably should fix it... On Apr 11, 4:48 am, Grumman-581 <grumman...@DIE-SPAMMER-SCUM- gmail.com> wrote: > On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 20:56:37 -0700, "Scott" > I just got through disassembling Kaitlyn's BC's inflator valve... > Seems that one of the O-rings has a slight leak to it and there are > very small bubbles escaping from around the button... Repairing these things is a diminishing returns deal. It works for a while, and then starts to leak again, so you fix it again, and it works for a shorter while, etc. I gave up on fixing the things and just replace them now. I haven't seen one yet that isn't junk, but there's one from Trident that seems to last a little longer. > On Apr 11, 4:48 am, Grumman-581 <grumman...@DIE-SPAMMER-SCUM- > gmail.com> wrote: > > I just got through disassembling Kaitlyn's BC's inflator valve... > > Seems that one of the O-rings has a slight leak to it and there are [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > just replace them now. I haven't seen one yet that isn't junk, but > there's one from Trident that seems to last a little longer. What he said. > Repairing these things is a diminishing returns deal. It works for a > while, and then starts to leak again, so you fix it again, and it > works for a shorter while, etc. I gave up on fixing the things and > just replace them now. I haven't seen one yet that isn't junk, but > there's one from Trident that seems to last a little longer. So does the issue usually end up being the O-ring or is there just some oxidation inside the barrel inside which the O-ring travels that is causing it to not be smooth and thus not providing a good seal? > > Repairing these things is a diminishing returns deal. It works for a > > while, and then starts to leak again, so you fix it again, and it [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > some oxidation inside the barrel inside which the O-ring travels that > is causing it to not be smooth and thus not providing a good seal? Yes. If you are determined, try a quick dip in CLR. > Yes. > > If you are determined, try a quick dip in CLR. I poured some vinegar in it last night... It looks cleaner at least... The problem that I see with being able to smooth the inside of the cylinder / barrel is that it is so damn small that nothing fits inside of there easily... The exterior portion that seals with the plastic of the inflator housing is easy to clean with a green scrubber or tooth brush, but the interior portion is so damn small that I haven't found anything that would fit inside there and also be good for cleaning it... Add to that the fact that I can't really see inside there either and it makes it kind of hit or miss on whether my efforts actually result in less bubbles... Hell, I doubt they even sell replacement parts for these damn things... They probably expect you to buy a whole new inflator... Seems like this would kind of be a point in favor of not buying the inflator / octo combination device... > > Yes. > > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > new inflator... Seems like this would kind of be a point in favor of > not buying the inflator / octo combination device... There are plenty of good reasons other than maintenance issues. > There are plenty of good reasons other than maintenance issues. Agreed, but if a small problem like this would result in you needing to replace the entire unit instead of being able to repair it, it kind of lead one to believe that the design was somewhat lacking... It's one thing to have to spend $20 for a replacement inflator valve when all that is wrong is a small piece of brass that probably should only cost a buck or so... It's quite another thing to have to spend $170 to replace the entire regulator because of the same problem... The best I can tell, the O-rings do not seat on a flat surface, but rather just slide along the inside of the cylinder... The inside diameter of the cylinder is perhaps only 1/8", so it's a tight fit with any tools that I happen to have on hand... >> Yes. >> >> If you are determined, try a quick dip in CLR. >The problem that I see with being able to smooth the inside of the >cylinder / barrel is that it is so damn small that nothing fits inside [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >and it makes it kind of hit or miss on whether my efforts actually >result in less bubbles... What about using a Bore mop? http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1286&title=BORE+MOPS Rick Simms > What about using a Bore mop? Not sure... On one end, the hole is considerably smaller, so I wouldn't be able to run the thing all the way through... I removed the O-rings earlier today... They are so small it was very difficult to see what type of condition they were in, even using a magnifying glass while standing outside in bright sunlight... Of course, removing them ended up destroying them in the process... > > What about using a Bore mop? > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > while standing outside in bright sunlight... Of course, removing them > ended up destroying them in the process... Jeez. Shitcan it and start over. You got took like I-have-no-idea-how-many-others. You need an inflator and hose? I'll send you one. > Shitcan it and start over. You got took like I-have-no-idea-how-many-others. Nawh, replacing the O-rings won't be that big of a deal if I can find them... It was interesting seeing how the valve was made anyway... I've never had an excuse to take one apart before... Yeah, when I was younger, I was one of those kids that took all the tubes out of the family TV when my parents were away to see what made it work... > You need an inflator and hose? Nawh... I can take one off another BC if replacing the O-rings doesn't fix it... > Nawh... I can take one off another BC if replacing the O-rings doesn't > fix it... O-rings wont fix it. Sorry to be the messenger that gets shot, but I have to deliver the message. Orders and all that rot. > O-rings wont fix it. Well, I stopped by Home Depot this afternoon... The weather was nice, so I took my sportbike out for a ride... As far as I could tell, it appeared that a #60 O-ring would work... While I was at it, I also picked up some that should fit the outer portion of the barrel in case it starts to leak... The O-rings when on easily enough and after reassembling everything, no leaks detected... So, at least for now, it did fix it... So, no one makes an inflator with a valve designed worth a damn? > Well, I stopped by Home Depot this afternoon... The weather was nice, > so I took my sportbike out for a ride... As far as I could tell, it [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > reassembling everything, no leaks detected... So, at least for now, it > did fix it... It will work for a while. > So, no one makes an inflator with a valve designed worth a damn? Halcyon makes a nice stainless steel one, "the last inflator valve you'll ever need". It has been recalled and redesigned and it is still a POS. I've had the best service from the black one with the button and oral inflator on the same side from Trident. > Halcyon makes a nice stainless steel one, "the last inflator valve > you'll ever need". It has been recalled and redesigned and it is still a > POS. > > I've had the best service from the black one with the button and oral > inflator on the same side from Trident. Damn, makes you think that perhaps we should go back to the old manually inflated horse collar BCs... <grin> >> What about using a Bore mop? > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > while standing outside in bright sunlight... Of course, removing them > ended up destroying them in the process... We're talking about the low pressure inflator here, right? I seem to recall that at least one of them was nothing more than a Schrader valve (did I spell that right?). If so, a new valve should be easy to find and cheap to purchase. Lee > "Grumman-581" <grumman581@DIE-SPAMMER-SCUM-gmail.com> wrote in message > We're talking about the low pressure inflator here, right? > > I seem to recall that at least one of them was nothing more than a Schrader > valve (did I spell that right?). If so, a new valve should be easy to find > and cheap to purchase. The Schrader valve is in the hose. > We're talking about the low pressure inflator here, right? > > I seem to recall that at least one of them was nothing more than a Schrader > valve (did I spell that right?). If so, a new valve should be easy to find > and cheap to purchase. Although the inflator valve is probably designed similar to a Schrader valve, it's quite larger... > I made sure that I warned them > about the split fins being a gimick and told them that they couldn't > really go wrong with a pair of ScubaPro Jet Fins... Way to go. Turn down today's latest technology in favor of 40 year old technology. There is, you know, stuff that came out between the two. > Way to go. Turn down today's latest technology in favor of 40 year old > technology. There is, you know, stuff that came out between the two. Perhaps, but since Jet Fins are still around, I don't think they could be considered a fad... They gotta have at least something going for them to have lasted this long... >> Way to go. Turn down today's latest technology in favor of 40 year old >> technology. There is, you know, stuff that came out between the two. > Perhaps, but since Jet Fins are still around, I don't think they could > be considered a fad... They gotta have at least something going for > them to have lasted this long... Clearly a matter of opinion. Mine differs. I didn't like them when they first came out and I don't like them today. I do, however, really like my Mares Avanti TRE, Plana Avanti and even my Power Quatro full foot fins. Lee <snip> > I just got through disassembling Kaitlyn's BC's inflator valve... > Seems that one of the O-rings has a slight leak to it and there are [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > wouldn't really worry about it, but the instructor mentioned it, so I > guess I probably should fix it... If it's a Schraeder valve, you can buy them and the tool to change them at any auto parts store. I haven't bought one in a Long Time but I can't imagine that they cost more than a buck or two each (tool and valve). -- John Eells > <scuba.edmon...@gmail.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Swimming and diving have nothing in common. One commonality might be an individual's comfort level in the water. If someone avoids swimming because they simply do not like water, I see that as a red flag. * > I'm not an instructor, but if I were, I would require both swims. First the > 200 yards, then a five minute rest, then the 300 yards swim/snorkel. Only 5 minutes? That doesn't give enough time to enjoy a couple of beers between the two swims... On Apr 11, 4:53 am, Grumman-581 <grumman...@DIE-SPAMMER-SCUM- gmail.com> wrote: > > I'm not an instructor, but if I were, I would require both swims. First the > > 200 yards, then a five minute rest, then the 300 yards swim/snorkel. > > Only 5 minutes? That doesn't give enough time to enjoy a couple of > beers between the two swims... How things have changed. We did a 1/4 mile (440yd) warm-up swim before every pool session for ~8 weeks. The final exam was a 1/2 mile swim (880yds). There was also ~15 minutes of treading water, roughly 5 standard, 5 without the use of feet and 5 without the use of hands (the toughest part). Then we did a motionless float; probably 10-15 minutes worth; it felt like forever. No one flunked. -hh > The final exam was a 1/2 mile swim (880yds). There was also ~15 > minutes of treading water, roughly 5 standard, 5 without the use of > feet and 5 without the use of hands (the toughest part). You should try it while holding a ten pound diving brick over your head. God, I miss being a lifeguard. |
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