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Scuba Forum / General / September 2004Re: Need a Scuba refresher
I was certified about eight years ago and since then have only done about a half dozen dives. Since then I've only been freediving. I recently bought a 19cu/ft pony bottle with regulator to use for unstucking anchors or cutting out fish that has wrapped too deep for me to freedive. For this intended use, I'll only put the tank on to go down to cut kelp or loosen an anchor then come up slower than my bubbles. I don't expect my bottom time to exceed 2 minutes. I may go as deep as 90'. I don't believe I need any safety stops, correct? Oh, I also won't be mixing the two (freediving, scuba). Once I retrieve the fish or anchor, I'm done. Well, I've been thinking about the upcoming lobster season and I would like to use my new tank for some shallow water bug hunting. I've always just freedived for lobster and never to more than 40'. When scuba diving, what circumstances necessitate a safety stop? If I dive in 40' for 20 minutes, would I need to do a safety stop or can I ascend slower than my bubbles and be O.K? Again, I won't be mixing the two. I'll either freedive for the lobsters or scuba. Even though my diving is shallow, I can't remember what the margin of safety was for doing both, so I'll only do one. thanks -- Spinal Tap >I was certified about eight years ago and since then have only done >about a half dozen dives. Since then I've only been freediving. You may wish to consider re-taking the Basic Open Water certification course. It sound like you have forgotten a lot. Some of the information you are apparently missing could get you into big trouble. .. >For this intended use, I'll only put the tank on to go down to cut kelp >or loosen an anchor then come up slower than my bubbles. ... That could be too fast for safety. (It has been a LONG time since "slower than my bubbles" was an accepted guideline!) > ... I don't expect >my bottom time to exceed 2 minutes. I may go as deep as 90'. I don't >believe I need any safety stops, correct? .. >Well, I've been thinking about the upcoming lobster season and I would >like to use my new tank for some shallow water bug hunting. I've always >just freedived for lobster and never to more than 40'. When scuba >diving, what circumstances necessitate a safety stop? ... For safe nodecompression stop diving, you need to follow a table or computer base dive system on every dive.  SignatureCharlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's. > That could be too fast for safety. (It has been a LONG time since > "slower than my bubbles" was an accepted guideline!) It was never an accepted guideline. No faster than your medium sized bubbles was. So was no faster than your small bubbles. If it was safe for 30 years or so, I suspect it's still safe. Lee > ... No faster than your medium sized bubbles ... > ... than your small bubbles. If it was safe for >30 years or so, I suspect it's still safe. "Safe" is relative. It was and is safer that simply racing to the surface. It is less safe that current practice. SignatureCharlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's. > > ... No faster than your medium sized bubbles ... > > ... than your small bubbles. If it was safe for > >30 years or so, I suspect it's still safe. > > "Safe" is relative. It was and is safer that simply racing to the surface. > It is less safe that current practice. No, it's not. You're either safe or you're not. There's no between. Not bent = safe. Bent = not safe. >I was certified about eight years ago and since then have only done >about a half dozen dives. Since then I've only been freediving. > >I recently bought a 19cu/ft pony bottle with regulator to use for >unstucking anchors or cutting out fish that has wrapped too deep for me >to freedive. A 19ft tank is plenty enough to get you into trouble, not nearly enough to get you out. >For this intended use, I'll only put the tank on to go down to cut kelp >or loosen an anchor then come up slower than my bubbles. I don't expect >my bottom time to exceed 2 minutes. I may go as deep as 90'. I don't >believe I need any safety stops, correct? An unexperienced diver going solo to 90 ft on a 19ft tank? I think you need to worry more about whether your body will be found. I would definitely recommend a stop from 90. Remember you time to descend and ascend when you figure how much air you'll need. And what happens if it take you longer than a minute or two? You're looking at a task of unknown difficulty. What happens if the anchor is really and truely fouled? >Oh, I also won't be mixing the two (freediving, scuba). Once I retrieve >the fish or anchor, I'm done. Are you freediving before you scuba dive? >Well, I've been thinking about the upcoming lobster season and I would >like to use my new tank for some shallow water bug hunting. I've always >just freedived for lobster and never to more than 40'. When scuba >diving, what circumstances necessitate a safety stop? If I dive in 40' >for 20 minutes, would I need to do a safety stop or can I ascend slower >than my bubbles and be O.K? I doubt you'll get 20 minutes out of your tank. >Again, I won't be mixing the two. I'll either freedive for the lobsters >or scuba. Even though my diving is shallow, I can't remember what the >margin of safety was for doing both, so I'll only do one. Me thinks you need to do some book review. You're well on your way to becoming a statistic. >thanks Signaturedillon When I was a kid, I thought the angel's name was Hark and the horse's name was Bob. > > ... If I dive in 40' for 20 minutes, would I need to do > > a safety stop or can I ascend slower > > than my bubbles and be O.K? > > I doubt you'll get 20 minutes out of your tank. My estimate is 7.3 minutes, but that assumes an OOA ascent from 40fsw. If you choose to not fully drain the tank and to pull a standard 3 minute safety stop, probably talking about 5 minutes. Shorter if he's exerting himself and/or in coldwater. > >Again, I won't be mixing the two. I'll either freedive for the lobsters > >or scuba. Even though my diving is shallow, I can't remember what the > >margin of safety was for doing both, so I'll only do one. You're really, really, really better off going back to take a refresher and then take a regular AL80 on even a shallow 40fsw lobster dive. Even if you want to disregard the life expectancy comments, it will pay for itself in lobster yield on the very first day. -hh > For this intended use, I'll only put the tank on to go down to cut kelp > or loosen an anchor then come up slower than my bubbles. I don't expect > my bottom time to exceed 2 minutes. I may go as deep as 90'. I don't > believe I need any safety stops, correct? A safety stop is for added safety. If you actually need it, it was a deco stop. On the other hand, if you believe in safety stops for any diving, you probably should do one on all diving. The rule has never been come up slower than your bubbles. It used to be come up no faster than your medium sized bubbles, then small bubbles. Either one should be fine for as long as you're likely to be at depth with a pony bottle . . . in a single dive. > Oh, I also won't be mixing the two (freediving, scuba). Once I retrieve > the fish or anchor, I'm done. Yes you will. If you free dive first, you're mixing freediving and scuba. If you dive first, you're mixing freediving and scuba. Time spent at depth is time spent at depth. > Well, I've been thinking about the upcoming lobster season and I would > like to use my new tank for some shallow water bug hunting. I've always > just freedived for lobster and never to more than 40'. When scuba > diving, what circumstances necessitate a safety stop? If I dive in 40' > for 20 minutes, would I need to do a safety stop or can I ascend slower > than my bubbles and be O.K? Use Google to search out some tables. If you can't find them or can't understand them, learn how to before you pursue further diving. Lee Please make sure you make out your Last Will and Testament before retrieving your anchor from 90 feet with a 19 cu. ft. bottle. Hey, can you put me down for the 19 cu. ft. bottle? Take a refresher course at least, and don't dive solo. You are asking for trouble, and the ocean is more than happy to give it to you. - Don PADI MSDT > I was certified about eight years ago and since then have only done > about a half dozen dives. Since then I've only been freediving. [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > Spinal Tap's Profile: http://forums.deeperblue.net/member.php?action=getinfo&userid=3187 > View this thread on DeeperBlue.net: http://forums.deeperblue.net/showthread.php?threadid=53081 Thanks for the replies. Some of you scuba divers crack me up. A simple "I would advise against it, here are the reasons..." just wouldn't surfice huh? -- Spinal Tap A mild "I would advise against it" is a little understated to be effective when someone kneels down in front of an onrushing train to tie his shoe. . Steve > Thanks for the replies. Some of you scuba divers crack me up. A simple > "I would advise against it, here are the reasons..." just wouldn't [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Spinal Tap's Profile: http://forums.deeperblue.net/member.php?action=getinfo&userid=3187 > View this thread on DeeperBlue.net: http://forums.deeperblue.net/showthread.php?threadid=53081 >Thanks for the replies. Some of you scuba divers crack me up. A simple >"I would advise against it, here are the reasons..." just wouldn't >surfice huh? .. and if that is your attitude, just ignoring you would have done as much good! But we chose to try to make it clear that what you suggested has an unacceptably high risk or serious injury or death -- whether you believe so or not. And as for "here are the reasons" ... it just isn't that simple. From your question it is clear that you are missing a LOT of knowledge that is *REQUIRED* to SCUBA dive safely. You really need to [re]take the Basic Open Water course. But if it just cracks you up, I guess it would be a waste of time. Now someone will accuse me of casting pearls before swine. True. My hope is that even if the swine doesn't benefit, other readers may. And if you just posted for the purpose of talking down the good folks who took your interst to heart and tried to help you... Well, in that case, shame on me for being taken in. (Guess you touched a nerve.) SignatureCharlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying) All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's. |
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