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Scuba Forum / General / March 2004digital question..2 strobes?
Is the difference that much greater with 2 strobes as opposed to one.? thanks > Is the difference that much greater with 2 strobes as opposed to one.? > thanks If you are shooting macros or fairly close, probably not. If you are shooting wide angle lens your lighting will be more uniform. Also, a second strobe will tend to lessen shadows.  SignatureHydrogen & Stupidity...the two most common elements in the universe. > If you are shooting macros or fairly close, probably not. If you are > shooting wide angle lens your lighting will be more uniform. Also, a > second strobe will tend to lessen shadows. When do you leave on your trip to Belize? >>If you are shooting macros or fairly close, probably not. If you are >>shooting wide angle lens your lighting will be more uniform. Also, a >>second strobe will tend to lessen shadows. > > When do you leave on your trip to Belize? It was SUPPOSED to be in June. Now its in serious question. Just late yesterday afternoon talked to the guy who is organizing the trip and he said the group of people who approached him to organize it, have now backed out. :( He was really looking forward to Belize, as was I. However, they also have an alternative trip during the same time planned to Coz, so I may very well be going there instead. Oh well, clear warm water is....well...clear warm water. SignatureHydrogen & Stupidity...the two most common elements in the universe. > It was SUPPOSED to be in June. Now its in serious question. Just late > yesterday afternoon talked to the guy who is organizing the trip and he [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Oh well, clear warm water is....well...clear warm water. Sure but you could easily put it together yourself to go to Belize if you want to. I suppose he felt he needed the group to make it worthwhile for him to organize? >>It was SUPPOSED to be in June. Now its in serious question. Just late >>yesterday afternoon talked to the guy who is organizing the trip and he [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > want to. I suppose he felt he needed the group to make it worthwhile for > him to organize? Its probably cheaper if you get a package deal. Certainly a lot less hassle. I think they were going through a travel agent to set it up. SignatureHydrogen & Stupidity...the two most common elements in the universe. > > Sure but you could easily put it together yourself to go to Belize if you > > want to. I suppose he felt he needed the group to make it worthwhile for > > him to organize? > > Its probably cheaper if you get a package deal. Certainly a lot less > hassle. I think they were going through a travel agent to set it up. By the time the organizer gets a free trip and commissions out of it, a package trip often costs more to the customer. If the package is hosted by the resort or dive operation, you can probably get the same deal yourself. As for hassle, dealing with an entire group can complicate things. I found Ambergris Caye very accessible on my own - getting a group from Belize City to Ambergris and back would seem to be more of a hassle. Airline reservations are a cinch to make online. Most hotels and dive ops have e-mail at least, if not direct online reservation capabilities, so there's no problem inquiring about packages and making reservations without even incurring the cost of a phone call to Belize. Unless a travel agent offers a "really good deal", they're only another potential "failure point" in the travel loop. For remote travel, where you're really relying on an agent's expertise, maybe they're worth it. But to get to Temptation Island, you simply hop on a short Continental flight out of Houston and three hours later you wind up in a country where practically everyone speaks English and everyone accepts U.S. Dollars. It ain't exactly rocket science, nor is it even a "hassle". (All that aside, you'll probably end up with much better diving in Cozumel) (snip) While I agree most of what Greg has stated with regards to the ease of organizing and making your own travel to Belize. Not to mention that you have a friend here at rec.scuba that can easily get you pointed in all the right directions. > (All that aside, you'll probably end up with much better diving in Cozumel)> I must take exception to the above comment. Greg is really in no position to judge. He was there for only 5 days and was blown out most days. The very few dives that he did get in were not at the best sites due to sea conditions and visibility sucked, also due to the weather. > While I agree most of what Greg has stated with regards to the ease of > organizing and making your own travel to Belize. Not to mention that you > have a friend here at rec.scuba that can easily get you pointed in all the > right directions. I was trying to point him in all the right directions, i.e. north to Cozumel. > > (All that aside, you'll probably end up with much better diving in > Cozumel)> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > very few dives that he did get in were not at the best sites due to sea > conditions and visibility sucked, also due to the weather. Can't slip anything by you, huh? Besides, I was there for 6 days. That makes me an expert. > > While I agree most of what Greg has stated with regards to the ease of > > organizing and making your own travel to Belize. Not to mention that you [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I was trying to point him in all the right directions, i.e. north to > Cozumel. But he will love San Pedro and the dives there. > > > (All that aside, you'll probably end up with much better diving in > > Cozumel)> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Can't slip anything by you, huh? :^) > Besides, I was there for 6 days. That makes me an expert. Ya, six days of not taking your friend's advice. Six days of mostly blown out diving. One day of going out on a crappy little boat that couldn't access the good sites. Had you just taken your friend's advice, you'd probably have done at least 1/2 a dozen dives with Amigos del Mar and you'd have come back singing the praises. Further, had you taken your friend's advice, you'd have eaten better and had a lot more fun too. > > > While I agree most of what Greg has stated with regards to the ease of > > > organizing and making your own travel to Belize. Not to mention that you [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > Further, had you taken your friend's advice, you'd have eaten better and had > a lot more fun too. I'd guess he'd have eaten better still and had even more fun if he'd have taken his friend instead of just his friend's advice... "chilly" <slarson@shaw.canada> pounded away at his keyboard resulting in: :I must take exception to the above comment. Greg is really in no position :to judge. I am, and I agree with him. Dan Bracuk If at first you don't succeed, you run the risk of failure. The Best of rec.scuba http://www.pathcom.com/~bracuk/RecScuba/ > "chilly" <slarson@shaw.canada> pounded away at his keyboard resulting > in: > :I must take exception to the above comment. Greg is really in no position > :to judge. > > I am, and I agree with him. You did not go to San Pedro. You've had one liveaboard, AFAIK. "chilly" <slarson@shaw.canada> pounded away at his keyboard resulting in: :You did not go to San Pedro. You've had one liveaboard, AFAIK. If the diving near San Pedro is so good why do the liveaboards not go there? Dan Bracuk If at first you don't succeed, you run the risk of failure. The Best of rec.scuba http://www.pathcom.com/~bracuk/RecScuba/ > "chilly" <slarson@shaw.canada> pounded away at his keyboard resulting > in: > :You did not go to San Pedro. You've had one liveaboard, AFAIK. > > If the diving near San Pedro is so good why do the liveaboards not go > there? If the diving near Cozumel is so good why do the liveaboards not go there? "chilly" <slarson@shaw.canada> pounded away at his keyboard resulting in: :If the diving near Cozumel is so good why do the liveaboards not go there? 1. I don't think they are allowed. 2. Given the currents and the abuncance of day boats, Cozumel is probably not the best spot for a liveaboard. But in Belize, there are at least 3 liveaboards, Nekton, Aggressor, and Dancer. None of them consider San Pedro to be worth the time and effort. Dan Bracuk If at first you don't succeed, you run the risk of failure. The Best of rec.scuba http://www.pathcom.com/~bracuk/RecScuba/ > "chilly" <slarson@shaw.canada> pounded away at his keyboard resulting > in: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > and Dancer. None of them consider San Pedro to be worth the time and > effort. Do you know that for a fact, or is it also because the reef breaks so close to shore and the surface at San Pedro. Further, it has always been my understanding that liveaboards, specifically target areas that are not so easily available from shore. That's kind of the point. > I must take exception to the above comment. Greg is really in no position > to judge. He was there for only 5 days Does this imply that five days isn't enough to make a valid statement generalizing the typical dive conditions? Whoda thunk it! Maybe it takes seven? > and was blown out most days. The > very few dives that he did get in were not at the best sites due to sea > conditions and visibility sucked, also due to the weather. I wonder if this situation can happen in other dive venues besides Belize? ;o) Steve Kramer Chiang Mai, Thailand http://www.photoenvisions.com Five years, seven months, two days, 47 minutes and 34 seconds. 61230 cigarettes not smoked, saving $15,307.75. Time used for a better purpose: 30 weeks, 2 days, 14 hours, 30 minutes. Signature"The real voyage of discovery is not in seeking new lands, but in seeing with new eyes!" Marcel Proust > > I must take exception to the above comment. Greg is really in no position > > to judge. He was there for only 5 days > > Does this imply that five days isn't enough to make a valid statement > generalizing the typical dive conditions? Whoda thunk it! Maybe it > takes seven? Sure, he'd be in a better position to make that determination, if he'd dived as many sites as possible in the area and hadn't been blown out. > > and was blown out most days. The > > very few dives that he did get in were not at the best sites due to sea > > conditions and visibility sucked, also due to the weather. > > I wonder if this situation can happen in other dive venues besides > Belize? ;o) Probably. However, if you go somewhere and dive all the sites, some of them more times than you care to do, and are advised by the locals that the conditions are normal and many other divers, thereafter concur then I'd say, a person could have a pretty good idea of what's what. After all, Kramer, you've finally admitted yourself that the diving in Koh Tao, isn't all that. > (snip) > While I agree most of what Greg has stated with regards to the ease of [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > very few dives that he did get in were not at the best sites due to sea > conditions and visibility sucked, also due to the weather. You can get that anywhere. SignatureHydrogen & Stupidity...the two most common elements in the universe. >>>Sure but you could easily put it together yourself to go to Belize if > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > package trip often costs more to the customer. If the package is hosted by > the resort or dive operation, you can probably get the same deal yourself. Well, I am not a real good trip organizer myself. I figured that whoever leads the trip gets one or two slots free. I don't have a problem with that. > As for hassle, dealing with an entire group can complicate things. I found > Ambergris Caye very accessible on my own - getting a group from Belize City > to Ambergris and back would seem to be more of a hassle. I have been on trips with this guy before through the LDS and he has always been pretty good about getting things done. One of the other divers that was signed up for this trip was my buddy two years ago in Bonaire and we got along great both as roommates and dive buddies. So I really wasn't concerned about the rest of the group. > Airline reservations are a cinch to make online. Most hotels and dive ops > have e-mail at least, if not direct online reservation capabilities, so > there's no problem inquiring about packages and making reservations without > even incurring the cost of a phone call to Belize. Have not book airline tickets online but have booked hotel rooms. January, I got a pretty good deal, online, in Key West. Unless a travel agent > offers a "really good deal", they're only another potential "failure point" > in the travel loop. For remote travel, where you're really relying on an > agent's expertise, maybe they're worth it. My experience with one of the local travel agents in the past has actually been pretty good but I havn't been through them lately. All of my recent trips have been through the LDS. But to get to Temptation Island, > you simply hop on a short Continental flight out of Houston and three hours > later you wind up in a country where practically everyone speaks English and > everyone accepts U.S. Dollars. It ain't exactly rocket science, nor is it > even a "hassle". Hmmmmmm....sounds a lot like Key West. :) > (All that aside, you'll probably end up with much better diving in Cozumel) Whew......after all that and you wind up telling me to go to Coz anyhow???? Well, that looks to be the case. Got an email from the trip organizer tonight and it looks like Belize is off. I will probably try to make it Coz instead if I can work my schedule accordingly. Have to contact the LDS tomorrow for details. Thanks for the info though. SignatureHydrogen & Stupidity...the two most common elements in the universe. Nitespark <nitespark@h8spam.cox.net> pounded away at his keyboard resulting in: :Its probably cheaper if you get a package deal. Certainly a lot less :hassle. Less hassle? How many trips were you going to take and then didn't because somebody couldn't get a large enough group together? To me, that's a hassle. Dan Bracuk If at first you don't succeed, you run the risk of failure. The Best of rec.scuba http://www.pathcom.com/~bracuk/RecScuba/ > Nitespark <nitespark@h8spam.cox.net> pounded away at his keyboard > resulting in: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > How many trips were you going to take and then didn't because somebody > couldn't get a large enough group together? To me, that's a hassle. Actually this is the first one. Actually, I could have "insisted" on going and they would have made the trip happen, but the LDS would have lost money on the deal. The guy that runs it is a pretty decent fellow and I am not gonna screw him just for something like this. Am I disaapointed in not going to Belize??? Yup. They are even offering to knock $75 off the cost of the trip to Coz because of the cancellation. But at least I got a good 2.5 months heads up so I can make alternate plans. SignatureHydrogen & Stupidity...the two most common elements in the universe. #Is the difference that much greater with 2 strobes as opposed to one.? #thanks # # It offers more control over lighting in macro, and helps a lot with wide angle shots in getting even light coverage. That said, you can get good results with macro using one strobe (for example, dramatic lighting is usually from one direction) and good wide angle results with just ambient light and a small amount of front fill. Bottom line - two strobes are really nice to have. You can work around them if you have the skill, but they make life a lot easier. > Is the difference that much greater with 2 strobes as opposed to one.? > thanks Using two strobes will allow you to control the contour and modeling of your subjects. Lighting from just one side tends to either flatten the subject (front lighting) or create hard shadows (side lighting.) Using a diffusing dome helps, but using two strobes helps even more. By varying the light intensity between them you can create the shadow and contours that you want. Attach modeling lights to your strobes if you don't already have them built in. This will allow you to aim your lights exactly where you want them to fall. In macro mode you can have the background illuminated to a different degree than the subject, and from a different angle. In wide angle shooting there is less light fall-off at the edges of your frame and more consistent lighting over the entire field. Steve Kramer Chiang Mai, Thailand http://www.photoenvisions.com Five years, seven months, one day, 11 hours, 38 minutes and 19 seconds. 61214 cigarettes not smoked, saving $15,303.64. Time used for a better purpose: 30 weeks, 2 days, 13 hours, 10 minutes. Signature"The real voyage of discovery is not in seeking new lands, but in seeing with new eyes!" Marcel Proust |
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