Diver Lost in NH Lake Winnipesaukee

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Ed - 13 Mar 2004 16:46 GMT

Thurs 3/11/04 15:45 Mark Miller a Laconia firefighter was reported
lost and presumed drowned off of Weirs Beach Lake Winnipesaukee during
what my local news reported as a equipment checkout dive. The missing
diver got separated from his partner (also a firefighter) during the
ascent.

From the tv report (no images) and the online report (with video) it
appears the entry area was open water, but ice cover was nearby with
reports of crews drilling through 2ft of ice to insert cameras in an
attempt to find the diver.

the dive was near the Mt Washington pier, and they report there was no
plan to go under the ice. There was no snow pack on the ice and a
sunny day so he might have wandered under the ice wihtout knowing (?)

http://www.theunionleader.com/articles_showa.html?article=34424
or
http://tinyurl.com/3xwzl

http://www.thewmurchannel.com/news/2915977/detail.html
http://tinyurl.com/22wgm
--

refillable drysuit talc bag $9.95 ppd
http://www.underwaterusa.com

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Chris Brearley - 13 Mar 2004 16:38 GMT

> Thurs 3/11/04 15:45 Mark Miller a Laconia firefighter was reported
> lost and presumed drowned off of Weirs Beach Lake Winnipesaukee during
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> refillable drysuit talc bag $9.95 ppd
> http://www.underwaterusa.com

The body was recovered yesterday (Friday). This is the Saturday Boston
Globe article

LACONIA, N.H.

Fire Department diver's body recovered
Divers yesterday recovered the body of a Fire Department diver who
disappeared during a practice exercise in Lake Winnipesaukee. The body of
Lieutenant Mark Miller, 43, an 18-year veteran, was found about 1 p.m.
Scores of firefighters who helped in the search formed a double line on a
dock and saluted as colleagues carried a flag-draped stretcher to a waiting
vehicle. Miller, head of the department's diving team, disappeared Thursday
afternoon while trying out new diving suits in the icy lake with a fellow
firefighter. (AP)

-chris

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Alan Street - 14 Mar 2004 04:48 GMT

#Thurs 3/11/04 15:45 Mark Miller a Laconia firefighter was reported
#lost and presumed drowned off of Weirs Beach Lake Winnipesaukee during
#what my local news reported as a equipment checkout dive. The missing
#diver got separated from his partner (also a firefighter) during the
#ascent.
#
#From the tv report (no images) and the online report (with video) it
#appears the entry area was open water, but ice cover was nearby with
#reports of crews drilling through 2ft of ice to insert cameras in an
#attempt to find the diver.
#
#the dive was near the Mt Washington pier, and they report there was no
#plan to go under the ice. There was no snow pack on the ice and a
#sunny day so he might have wandered under the ice wihtout knowing (?)
#
#http://www.theunionleader.com/articles_showa.html?article=34424
#or
#http://tinyurl.com/3xwzl
#
#http://www.thewmurchannel.com/news/2915977/detail.html
#http://tinyurl.com/22wgm
#--
#
#refillable drysuit talc bag $9.95 ppd
#http://www.underwaterusa.com

From the second link:

"The missing diver is said to be an experienced diver and was wearing a
wet suit and a tank"

I know news reports often get fact wrong, so I'm curious if he was
really wearing a wetsuit in an ice diving enviornment.

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Dan Bracuk, CTHD - 14 Mar 2004 14:26 GMT

Alan Street <alan@nonono_irsi.com> pounded away at his keyboard
resulting in:

:I know news reports often get fact wrong, so I'm curious if he was
:really wearing a wetsuit in an ice diving enviornment.

I've done it. What's the big deal?

Dan Bracuk
If at first you don't succeed, you run the risk of failure.
The Best of rec.scuba http://www.pathcom.com/~bracuk/RecScuba/

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Alan Street - 14 Mar 2004 20:16 GMT

>Alan Street <alan@nonono_irsi.com> pounded away at his keyboard
>resulting in:
>:I know news reports often get fact wrong, so I'm curious if he was
>:really wearing a wetsuit in an ice diving enviornment.
>
>I've done it. What's the big deal?

Cold?
Ice-cream headache cold?

For me, mid 40s (F) is about all I can stand with a wetsuit, and even
then it's not for very long or very deep. I can't imagine doing mid
30s in a wetsuit.

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David Gintz $formerly newdiver2@aol.com$ - 14 Mar 2004 15:32 GMT

> I know news reports often get fact wrong, so I'm curious if he was
> really wearing a wetsuit in an ice diving enviornment.

I saw the report on the local news of the other divers doing their search
for the body and it appeared that they were all wearing the same orange
suit. It appeared from the brief footage (and in the background) that it was
a drysuit.

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Richard Kaszeta - 17 Mar 2004 15:13 GMT

> #Thurs 3/11/04 15:45 Mark Miller a Laconia firefighter was reported
> #lost and presumed drowned off of Weirs Beach Lake Winnipesaukee during
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> I know news reports often get fact wrong, so I'm curious if he was
> really wearing a wetsuit in an ice diving enviornment.

He wasn't, it was a new drysuit they were trying out. Although other
people have pointed out that you can wear a wet suit in ice diving
(and that vast majority of my 5+ years of ice diving has been wearing
exactly that), doing it professionally in an S+R situation really
mandates using a dry suit.

As an active ice diver, I'm much more disturbed that they weren't using
any safety line, and today on the radio I heard interviews with other
firefighters in the department talking about "nobody ever thought the
ice would be a problem".

These people need to get some real overhead environment training, and
*fast*.

Signature

Richard W Kaszeta
rich@kaszeta.org
http://www.kaszeta.org/rich

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Charlie Hammond - 17 Mar 2004 16:00 GMT

>As an active ice diver, I'm much more disturbed that they weren't using
>any safety line, and today on the radio I heard interviews with other
>firefighters in the department talking about "nobody ever thought the
>ice would be a problem".

It sounds like they were diving in open water but somehow ended up
under the ice. It is not possible to say, based on the information
I have read, whether this was the result of a stupid mistake, or
simply a tragic accident.

ALL SCUBA diving has risks. Any one of us could die on any dive.

Signature

Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA
(hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)
All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.

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Chris Guynn - 17 Mar 2004 16:09 GMT

> >As an active ice diver, I'm much more disturbed that they weren't using
> >any safety line, and today on the radio I heard interviews with other
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
> ALL SCUBA diving has risks. Any one of us could die on any dive.

You all heard it. No more muff diving... ;-)

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Chris Brearley - 17 Mar 2004 16:11 GMT

Diving in open water was the impression I had from earlier news reports, it
seems they were testing out some new dry suits.

The following is from the March 17th issue of the Union Leader which states
they started in open water and somehow he got lost under the ice.

"Miller, a master diver and 18-year veteran of the department, was diving in
open water March 11 with fellow firefighter J.P. Hobby when the accident
occurred. They were near the berth for the MV Mount Washington, which is
currently in dry dock and the two were testing new diving suits. Miller was
last seen giving a thumbs up, signaling intent to surface about 2:30 p.m.
Hobby surfaced but Miller did not.

Searches yielded Miller's body at noontime Friday, a short distance away
under the ice in 20 feet of water. What happened remains a mystery, but is
under investigation by the state Fish and Game Department."

-chris

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nobody - 17 Mar 2004 18:18 GMT

> Diving in open water was the impression I had from earlier news reports, it
> seems they were testing out some new dry suits....

By definition, if there is ice anywhere within the possibility of
getting under it, whether by being lost, disoriented or pulled by
currents, etc., then it should be treated as an ice dive. I agree with
the earlier post stating that they should have had a life line.
Apparently, from what was written, the ice was fairly close to their
test dive location. BTW, what credentials does the State Fish and Game
Department have which makes them qualified to do the investigation?
Anyone know?

> Searches yielded Miller's body at noontime Friday, a short distance away
> under the ice in 20 feet of water. What happened remains a mystery, but is
> under investigation by the state Fish and Game Department."
>
> -chris

Bart F.

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Charlie Hammond - 17 Mar 2004 19:27 GMT

>By definition, if there is ice anywhere within the possibility of
>getting under it, whether by being lost, disoriented or pulled by
>currents, etc., then it should be treated as an ice dive. I agree with
>the earlier post stating that they should have had a life line.

I agree with this, but there is always a grey area where one diver
might say, "There IS a possibility", while another would say, "No way."
(One need look no farther that his news group to find examples of
SCUBA divers disagreeing.)

Signature

Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale FL USA
(hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)
All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.

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